Fish illness, co-morbid infections, my fish need your help!

[Biollante]

Hi Shawn,

I am afraid what you are describing is bad news; I have a call into a friend on that.

Had it been Anchor-worm, it would have been obvious. Both pulling (would have been difficult) and the “worm” would have been crusty, crunchy, since an anchor-worm is a crustacean, not an annelid.

My instincts are that it is a single infestation. Though the amount of organic material present it complicates things.

I think you can prepare the Fenbendazole with gelatin, what you want is enough gel to bind the food and Fenbendazole, grind the Fenbendazole as necessary mix at (about) 10 parts food, 10 parts gelatin, 1 part Fenbendazole (10:10:1).

I generally mix the Fenbendazole in the gelatin when it is about cool, then the food, I do not think it real matters though.

What happened with the PP? Did you ever get to 4-hours?

If you pick up rocks or dig around in the substrate, do you or have you seen any mini-earthworm looking things?

Have you fed this tank live food?

Any live Tubifex worms or something you might have thought was something else?

Biollante

[ShadowMac]

I have not seen anything under the driftwood when I have moved it other than a bunch of fire shrimp.

I have fed this tank frozen live food, no alive live. Other tanks have received the same food, and no issues in the other 3. This most likely came in with some fish, since that is the only thing not shared between the tanks. plants that are found in my 12 and 7 gallon came from plants that were in the 37. The 37 was replaced by this 90p, the fish remained the same. I have been more cautious about cross contamination since this has gone on and equipment and such has been cleaned/sterilized before going to other tanks.

The worms business showed up quite a while ago but never got bad until recently.

I'm still working with the PP. I have lost a few amano shrimp. I haven't hit the 4 hour mark yet and have to make more PP. I used 500 ml so far with 2 water changes of 80%.

[ShadowMac]

definitely not anchor worm after looking at some more pictures.

looks like it would fit the nematode category the best, however I have no idea which of the ones I saw.

[Biollante]

Hi Shawn,

Something is pumping organic material into the tank.


Most of these parasites are always around, most critters have something, just that in small numbers they rarely present a problem.

Live foods are a common source of parasites and pathogens, the frozen kind will not be a problem.

Just to make sure you are not currently using any malachite green, I know you were, but not currently, right.

No Formalin and formalin or formalin products, this can get nasty.

Using Neosporin was not a bad idea, PP is best or if no PP, 3% Hydrogen peroxide then Neosporin work.

What happens in other tanks when you treat with PP?

Biollante

[Biollante]

Hi Shawn,

How are the surgical patients doing in recovery?

Biollante

[ShadowMac]

I have never treated any of my other tanks with PP, my 12 gallon has had some bursts of algae, most likely due to a lack of water changes and CO2 instability. It was doing very well before that. My 7.5 gallon is doing great.

I suppose I could dose them for comparison. How much for the 7.5g 30C and the 12 gallon? I have another batch of PP, 5 grams to 500 ml distilled water. I have a low tech 20 gallon as well. That probably has a bunch of organic matter decaying, it gets few water changes and there are quite a few snails in there, that one is doing very well too.

The HC in my 48 has not done well. It grew for a couple weeks then hit a wall, probably CO2 issues. Could that be contributing greatly to the organic material? I plan to pull it all out and replace with glosso. Other plant melt? 40 stems of stauro repens melted, not many left. Things are recovering from my CO2 problems, but there was a lot of plant melt in response.

The fish in the recovery tank are doing well I think. Hanging out in a dark room, but showing more activity.

I wish I could have caught a couple cardinals, but after a half hour of trying I gave up. I really wanted to pull out whatever was in the tail of the one. I think he figured out I was after him and decided the large bunch of stems would be a good place to stay for the remainder of the day.

[Biollante]

Hi Shawn,

A smart person has just suggested that the high dissolved organics may have rendered the API General Cure ineffective.

It may be worthwhile to remove all of your critters to quarantine.

The recommendation includes a 30-minute bath in 10-ppm PP; this can be done every day for 5-days.

Personally, I would move them to quarantine and try the API General Cure, ²/₃ in the water, ¹/₃ soaked with food.

Hold off on the Fenbendazole for now.

You must find the source of the dissolved organic material, this is the most likely stressor, I am told that though deformed most of the critters should survive.

Since the other tanks, do not seem to have problems dose at 1.5-ppm.

• 7.5-gallon dose 3.5-ml
  
• 12-gallon dose 6-ml
• 20-gallon dose 10-ml
  

Same rule applies it needs to get through 4-hours in the pink.

Biollante

[ShadowMac]

Alright, I have ordered more general cure. I had only enough to treat the tank for one course.

I am now regretting giving my 29 gallon tank and stand away to a friends daughter since that was a good sized tank to quarantine and treat all of the fish. I will put the rams in my standard 10 gallon quarantine and the rest will go into a 5 gallon container of some sort. This will have to wait until next weekend when I have the time available. Should I worry about removing the inverts from the tank? Does anything more need to be done with the original aquarium?

I can't thank you enough for the constant assistance you have been providing. I really do appreciate it.

[Biollante]

Hi Shawn,

I know it will be a big pain, but the best thing I can think of is removing the driftwood and seeing if that is the source of the organic material.

Removing the inverts would be a good idea, as it would allow heavy PP dosing. As in turn of the filter and dose 10-ppm PP, that would be the 180-ml of 1% PP.

The excess organic material is substantial, a lot more than you are getting from your HC. Pretty much any recent plant losses, melting and so forth would be offset by large water changes.

In fact, large water changes control or eliminate most opportunistic pathogens and parasites.

• The addition of PP to further oxidize and guarantee low DOC/BOD along with the destruction of most external parasites is the answer.
  
• Something is going on and until the DOC issue can be stabilized my best estimation is that you will have multiple parasitic and sooner-or-later bacterial issues.
  

I say all of this to say I think you are going to have to take a close look at that driftwood.

Make sure the quarantine areas are will aerated.

Good luck and I am always happy to help, just sorry it didn’t go better, frankly it seemed pretty straight forward, but this is called experience.

Biollante

[ShadowMac]

I lost the two in the recovery tank. I can do a more thorough examination now. I can see that one did have a white coiled worm within the gills.

Would the high organics have made it difficult for some plants to grow? Would it have made it more difficult to inject CO2 effectively at appropriate levels?