Needle wheel DIY modifications

[shoggoth43]

Philosophos -

I've used the Quiet One pumps in the past. Back then they were made by Rainbow LifeGard or somesuch. Not too bad for flow/noise/power consumption. I had one that died though and given that it was nearly silent to start with I didn't notice. That was with the old Red/Orange/Brown metal housing. I have no idea how the new pumps are or who actually makes them but they appear to be completely different to the older ones.

Johnny_ftm -

You are unlikely to damage the canister filter in this manner any more than if you ran your filter slightly clogged. If anything, the suction from the powerhead will likely ease the load on the cannister. There was a discussion somewhere on this site about using them inline in the past. I don't think durability was discussed, but it's fairly common in IT to have two fans in series inside important equipment. One reason is that if one fails the other will provide some flow, another is that both fans do not work as hard which makes them less likely to fail in the first place, a third reason is that both together give higher pressure at the output and thus more flow. I see no reason why pumps would be any different except that there's a definite mismatch in pump curves so you probably just get the same flow out of the cannister you'd get with or without the powerhead.

-
S

[jonny_ftm]

In watercooling, it is well proven that running pumps in series will damage them sooner, especially if they're not of the same kind.

Also, running fans in series decreases their life, well reported in watercooling forums too.

Putting a 184gph pump in series with a 270gph canister could put a dramatic load on either pumps. Forcing a pump to output above its capacity for a certain resistance is a good way to kill it. So, even if the canister will have its real output decreased by resistance of filtering material/hoses, forcing it to output its empty or even above its empty capacity despite the resistance, will have unpredictable damaging results. Unless some have tested and reported it working for a long time with specific models, I don't feel running inline with a canister

[Tom Barr]

As mentioned above, run pumps in parallel loops, not the same in series loop.

You simply bleed off some flow and make your own loop for the smaller pump.
You will need a flow control valve(say two for in/backflow).

Same type of thing with the mazzei designs, they do not drive 100% of the flow through the ventrui valve, they bleed off and adjust the flow into it with a ball valve.
This optimizes the mist. Same deal here.

I think the performance is equal to that of the mazzei, but without the head loss, or the requirement to use so much flow and pressure. It's also independent of the filter if you make their own loop. No one is going to run a a large external pump just for CO2 alone.



Regards,
Tom Barr

[Tom Barr]

BTW, the 3 snipped blades work extremely well without fur.

Now there's little brand name requirement.

Regards,
Tom Barr

[shoggoth43]

I'll defer to those with more experience then. I do servers, not water cooling or high perf computer mods. I gave up on that stuff long ago and moved over to consoles for gaming.

-
S

In watercooling, it is well proven that running pumps in series will damage them sooner, especially if they're not of the same kind.

Also, running fans in series decreases their life, well reported in watercooling forums too.

Putting a 184gph pump in series with a 270gph canister could put a dramatic load on either pumps. Forcing a pump to output above its capacity for a certain resistance is a good way to kill it. So, even if the canister will have its real output decreased by resistance of filtering material/hoses, forcing it to output its empty or even above its empty capacity despite the resistance, will have unpredictable damaging results. Unless some have tested and reported it working for a long time with specific models, I don't feel running inline with a canister

[jonny_ftm]

As mentioned above, run pumps in parallel loops, not the same in series loop.

You simply bleed off some flow and make your own loop for the smaller pump.
You will need a flow control valve(say two for in/backflow).

Same type of thing with the mazzei designs, they do not drive 100% of the flow through the ventrui valve, they bleed off and adjust the flow into it with a ball valve.
This optimizes the mist. Same deal here.

Thanks Tom,

My english is really approximative so it is hard for me to imagine the design based on your words. I couldn't find a photo or details on the loop setup for a parallel setup.



Is this how I should set it up as inline?

[el_tubaron]

Hi,

I have the same doubt as jonny_ftm, but in my case I've got a sump with a Eheim pump. How can I connect the needle wheel (rio 1000) to my system, to have the best performance without losing flow rate?



Could it be like this?

Thanks

Victor Pinto

[Tom Barr]

Yes, both modifications can be done, in the sump example, you can add the mist into the suction side of the return pump also, then it would hit yet another impeller.

In the in line version, the seals are the main issues/leaks etc in the powerheads.

In the sump, this does not matter or in the tank.

In the in line method, smaller pumps are offered that have decent seals, Lifeguard, some of the other listed examples prior in the post, Mag 2 etc.

Regards,
Tom Barr

[Tom Barr]

BTW, a Rio 1000 in more(12w and 297 gph) than enough to supply a 180 Gal tank.

Regards,
Tom Barr

[jonny_ftm]

Hello,

Many thanks for confirming the inline setup. And yes, it is actually more complicated to setup than immersed config.

For immersed setup now, do you think a 80gph powerhead (Eheim compact 1000) for a 40-60 gal tank, would be enough to provide a godd mist distribution if coupled to other circulating pumps? Or even in that case, teh low RPM won't provide good CO2 myst?

The problem is that I personally find that anything above 80gph is too noisy with immersed pumps, even when suspended in the water with no contact with the glass.