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  • flourish Excel Alternatives

    Hi,

    I have heard you can use CIDEX Activated Dialdehyde Solution and metricide 14 day as a alternative to flourish excel. My problem is I can not locate these products in my area (Nova Scotia, Canada).

    Is it possible (and safe) to use metricide 28 day instead?

    How about CIDEX PLUS 28 Day Solution?

    I can get these products in my area but I don't know if they are safe to use.

    Thanks for your help.

  • #2
    Just Do Not "Plus" The Stuff

    Hi,

    I use Cidex Plus, though I will be switching to Metricide do to cost.

    The “Plus” in these things are a separate component, throw it away, do not mix it in the solution. :gw

    Around here somewhere is a pretty good thread on the differences and internet sources.

    Biollante
    The first sign we don't know what we are doing is an obsession with numbers. - Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

    Disclaimer: I am not trying to make you mad, it is just what I am, an evil plant monster, 'nuf said.
    • I believe the information I am giving is sound, I am not a veterinarian, professional chemist or particularly bright and certainly not a "Guru.".
    • I assume you are of legal age, competent and it is legal for you to acquire, possess and use any materials or perform any action in your in your jurisdiction.
    • When in doubt "don't."

    Comment


    • #3
      Or Metricide14

      http://www.dealmed.com/Products/Surf...4-Day-1-Gallon and it/s on sale.
      You can read this tread about Metricide14, if you like.
      http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/fe...nough-co2.html

      Over_stocked

      Metricide contains the only active ingredient in Excel and would save the average user a TON.

      For instance...

      2x2L of excel(just over 1 gallon, would run you 62 bucks(before shipping) from Big als. (just the first I chose, not sure if it is cheapest)

      1x1 gallon of Metricide 14 is 24 bucks shipped for me, from DealMed

      Now, assuming you dose it straight, 100%, not reduced at all, Metricide is 38% the cost of Excel. You would be paying 62% more for a lower concentration of Glutaraldehyde.

      Now, lets assume that you dilute it at a ratio of 1.5(Glutaraldehyde):1(distilled water) you end up with a percentage of 1.8% Glutaraldehyde--just over the excel level. This will make your 1 gallon of Metricide turn into 1 2/3 gallon(1.666) gallons of Excel equivalent.

      So, now, if diluted you would have the equivalent of about 100 dolars(before shipping) worth of Seachem Excel. On a 50 gallon tank, dosing at seachem dosing of 5ml per 50 gallons... you have 1261 doses... For 24 dollars.

      If you don't dilute it, but still dose 100%, you would have 757 doses(on a 50g tank) and be more concentrated. On my 75 gallon tank I dose 10ml daily/every other day of 100% metricide 14(2.7%). I have 378 doses in my bottle.

      The value is simple.

      All for 24 dollars shipped to my door and about 3 minutes of math.
      "Ich Hatte Einen Kameraden"

      "In the Shadow of Hermes"

      Comment


      • #4
        Biollante is right..........if you buy the Metricide, do not use the activator or "plus" as he called it.
        "Ich Hatte Einen Kameraden"

        "In the Shadow of Hermes"

        Comment


        • #5
          Thanks for your help.

          I order the cidex plus.

          In Nova Scotia metricide is the more expensive product. At least in the places I checked locally. Likely cause its imported from the US. One place quoted a gallon of metricide 14 @ $89.99!!! A gallon of cidex plus cost me $29.
          Last edited by redilyn; 04-06-2010, 11:40 PM.

          Comment


          • #6
            Go Cidex
            "Ich Hatte Einen Kameraden"

            "In the Shadow of Hermes"

            Comment


            • #7
              Yay Cidex

              Hi,

              Here the Metricide 14 is a lot cheaper.

              Do not use the little bottle attached to the big one that is the "Plus" in Cidex Plus. Metricide 14 calls the stuff an "activator" same stuff still do not want to use it for our plants. :gw

              The Cidex Plus has more of what we buy it for, so I cut it in half with distilled water. Makes it about the same strength as Excel.

              Treat the stuff with care, handle it as you would any strong alkaline cleaning solution and avoid breathing the stuff.

              Tom Barr also made a point a while back regarding prolonged exposure to the stuff as showing some health risk to people working in Dental offices, it bears watching. My local expert on such matters asserts that that is prolonged exposure to open trays of the solution in poorly ventilated areas, still, let us be careful. :gw


              Biollante
              The first sign we don't know what we are doing is an obsession with numbers. - Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

              Disclaimer: I am not trying to make you mad, it is just what I am, an evil plant monster, 'nuf said.
              • I believe the information I am giving is sound, I am not a veterinarian, professional chemist or particularly bright and certainly not a "Guru.".
              • I assume you are of legal age, competent and it is legal for you to acquire, possess and use any materials or perform any action in your in your jurisdiction.
              • When in doubt "don't."

              Comment


              • #8
                Yeah, be very careful with this stuff. I mix Metricide14 with DI water to make it Excel strengtht and I can tell you this stuff is BAD for your eyes and your lungs. Use glasses and a cover your nose and mouth. Also try to do it outside if you can b/c of the fumes.
                "Ich Hatte Einen Kameraden"

                "In the Shadow of Hermes"

                Comment


                • #9
                  So how much distilled water to cidex plus to make it excel strength?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I can't recall the thread, but if you do some hunting you'll find a guy who had Excel put through analysis at a lab and they came out with 1.5% glutaraldehyde. Cidex is 3.4%

                    1.5/3.4 = 0.441176

                    So a mix of 441ml:559ml Cidex : DI H2O will give you excel strength. A lot of people just dose 50% as much cidex without diluting and things work out fine.
                    - Dan

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Thanks that answers my question perfectly.

                      I wasn't sure what the concentration of cidex was, the msds I had just said <5%.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Hi Dan,

                        Metricide14 is 2.6 glutaraldehyde. I made 1875ml Excell like solution using 1125ml Metricide and 750ml water. This is suppose to give me a 1.8 glutaraldehyde solution. I hope I am right.
                        "Ich Hatte Einen Kameraden"

                        "In the Shadow of Hermes"

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Or maybe I'll just dose Metricide full strength. Since I was dosing 10ml Excel/day now I'll just dose 6 or 7ml of Metricide. Metricide is about 60% stronger than Excel.
                          "Ich Hatte Einen Kameraden"

                          "In the Shadow of Hermes"

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            You'd have a 1.56 solution:

                            =2.6*1125/1875

                            Close enough to dose like excel.

                            If you want to get anal and be at precisely 1.5ppm, add 0.03846ml of DI H2O for every ml of solution you've got there. If you haven't dosed any (1875ml still) then that'd be 72ml more.

                            TBH, you could probably just half dose metricide, or multiply however many ml you'd dose of excel by .58 for precision.
                            - Dan

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              1:1 Cidex To Distilled Water

                              Hi,

                              I just use 50% Cidex Plus, which is 3.4% glutaraldehyde. I use the solution next Excel I still have and I do not notice any difference.

                              Biollante
                              The first sign we don't know what we are doing is an obsession with numbers. - Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

                              Disclaimer: I am not trying to make you mad, it is just what I am, an evil plant monster, 'nuf said.
                              • I believe the information I am giving is sound, I am not a veterinarian, professional chemist or particularly bright and certainly not a "Guru.".
                              • I assume you are of legal age, competent and it is legal for you to acquire, possess and use any materials or perform any action in your in your jurisdiction.
                              • When in doubt "don't."

                              Comment

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