View Full Version : Algea\deficiency ?
12-21-2007, 01:29 AM
Fist of hello eveyone this will be my first post here.I have spent the last 2 weeks looking through the threads reading. I recently set-up a10 gal nano, and isn't going to bad. tank info is 3 20 watt no florecents 1 is odno, mini powerhead with sponge, diy co2, drop checker. Lighting is on about 9 hrs a day. EI doesing everyday, 3.5 ml nitrate,2 ml phosphate, 1\8 tsp potassium 1\4 tsp gh boost at water change,2.5 ml plantex, and 1.5 ml iron. I am seeing some htread\hair alge,gda which i've read seem to be excess nutrients. I'm also seeing some deficiency in my ludwigia repens and hygro polysperma, the ludwigia seems like an iron deficiency and the hygro seems to be a calcium deficiency. Any advise is graetly apriciated and will post some pics too.
12-21-2007, 02:17 AM
Some additional info ferts are all mixed with 250 ml water. So I'm adding iron is 0.15 ppm, plantex is 3 tsp into 250 ml water, nitrate 3.78ppm, phosphate is 1.06 ppm. Drop checker is a yellowish color. Co2 is run into mini powerhead and sprayed through a spray bar. There are 3 fish, 2 dwarf flag chiclids and a oto. The oto was just added today. Substarte is all purpose sand from low's with api fert tabs. VaughnH thanks for the diy drop checker artical and reference solution as my lfs would not order me one and had 50% of the parts already on hand. If any more info is needed just let me know. Thanks again for any help.
12-21-2007, 03:11 AM
"Excessive" nutrients doesn't cause algae. Usually a shortage of nutrients slows the plant growth and that can lead to algae. I think you are way too low on nitrates, if you are dosing 3-4 ppm. Most of the problems we run into with plant growth are caused by not having enough CO2 in the water, and not getting the CO2 enriched water in contact with all of the plants, so I suggest watching the plants to make sure all of the leaves are moving a bit in the water current. If the drop checker has 4 dKH distilled or deionized water in it, and is yellow, you have plenty of CO2 in the water where the drop checker is.
12-22-2007, 01:40 AM
If I'm reading it right it seems you have somewhere in the equivalent of 80 watts of light? If so it needs to be cut back by at least half if not 2/3.
12-26-2007, 11:56 PM
Yes Carissa you are raeding correctly 74 watts over this 10 gal and on for about 9 hrs a day. So I ajusted my ferts to this after VaughnH post nitrate 7 ml=7.56 ppm, phosphate 3 ml=1.59ppm, potassium 1\8 tsp barr's gh booster 1\4 tsp (after water change), plantex 2 ml, iron 2 ml=0.2 ppm all is being dosed daily except gh booster. I am still seeing hair\thread algea, and gda. I have noticed an increase in plant growth the last week. I also added some hydrogen peroxide twice add noticed a decrease in hair|thread alge. Would the dosage of iron be a bit much? A decrease in lighting either in wattage or hrs a day I would guess would help also. If anyone has any suggestions I would love to hear them. Thanks for all the help so far.
12-27-2007, 12:20 AM
I'm thinking that you'll find it pretty much impossible to get rid of algae with that much light. Scale back to about 3 or 4 wpg and I'm sure you'll see a big difference. Hours per day doesn't matter nearly as much as actual wattage when it comes to algae reduction. Fewer hours per day means less algae will grow that day, but the balance is still off so you'll just have the same problems, moving slower. Plants won't grow as much, algae won't grow as much. Reducing wattage will tip the balance more in favor of the plants and you'll see algae dying off, whereas plants continue to grow.
12-27-2007, 01:01 AM
From what I've read 20 gals and under the wpg rule dosn't apply as it takes twice the watts to get the same on a larger tank, but mayby I am misunderstanding this somehow. I will try and take one 20 watt bulb out of this equation and see how this does.
12-27-2007, 01:08 AM
It's true that you need more light on a smaller tank to get the same impact...but I think 74 watts is still overkill. I don't have any problem with algae in my 10g which has 18 watts of light. It is non-co2 but one of my best algae free tanks, and the plants are doing wonderfully with no signs of being starved of light. I think it's worth a try, anyway.
edit: I found a site with a spreadsheet that calculates lumens per square inch and converts it to a wpg rating, thus give a more accurate reading for wpg. When I plug in your numbers, I get 6.24 wpg. That's assuming you have a standard sized 10 gallon tank.
To get it down in the range of 3 or 4 wpg you'll have to go to two NO 20 watts, this will give you 3.3 wpg according to the calculation, I'm also assuming you have T8's.
12-27-2007, 01:50 AM
Ultimately it is not about rules and formulas but what is happening in your tank and how healthy it is. You have a recently set up tank with too much light over it that looks like it is headed for a bad period if you don't get a handle on the algae soon. Right now it isn't that bad. Carissa's suggestion to keep your light at 3-4 wpg is an excellent one. The more light the more sensitive the tank is to any minor imbalance between the light, CO2 and ferts. With less light you have more wiggle room. This is important when using DIY CO2, if you are not using multiple bottles with staggered re-charge you run a greater risk of the CO2 level fluctuating and with as much light as you want to use you would need rock steady CO2 levels. It doesn't look like any of the plants you currently have in the tank need excessive light. Have you thought through what exactly you would like to grow and whether anything absolutely needs that much light? If you don't have a specialized need for so much light you may be about to put yourself through a lot of unnecessary work and aggravation. One last thought. With a new tank it will be much easier for you to establish a healthy, balanced tank, with lower lighting levels the first few months (that wiggle room thing again.) If you drop your light levels back to 3wpg until you get rid of the algae and stabilize your tank you can always experiment with more light later. You will still be able to grow plenty of plants with that much light and will be getting a feel for how to adjust ferts and CO2 as your plant mass/fish load increases. Good knowledge/experience to have if you later decide to increase lighting and try some high light plants.
12-27-2007, 03:14 AM
Carissa could I get a link to that site you got those numbers from as it would be a good site to have on hand. I am not a total newbe to the planted tanks as I have a 29 gal also. Just still have problems figuring out the ferts and problems that come with it. The 29 gal has 4.2 wpg of cf and does pretty good as far as algea goes, a little green spot algea on glass and some green algea on some plant leaves. the 10 gal though this is my second atemt at it and is going better this time than the last. This tank was set up as kind of something to play with and try some things out, but I've noticed some plants seem to be doing much better such as rotula wallichii and christmas moss has started growing as it hadn't grown at all in the 29 gal. Oh and the stargrass does alot better in this tank also.
12-28-2007, 02:42 PM
Here is the link, it's near the bottom of the page...
Calculators and Tools. Taking suggestions for other online calcs. (http://justanothertank.com/calcs.php)
I always have some amount of green spot algae and gda in my diy co2 tank, I think the fluctuations in co2 cause this. A pleco keeps the tank pretty clean for me though. I've tried adjusting ferts and it doesn't really help, I'm sure it's the co2. It might be the same with your tank, but the extremely high lighting will only make a co2 fluctuation issue even more difficult to deal with than it would be otherwise. I have 2 - 40w odno on that tank, it's a 32g. When I went from no to odno, there was a significant increase in the speed at which the algae would grow but my pleco keeps up with it well. The ferts seem to prevent algae from forming on the plants themselves, but it will grow on decorations and the glass. I can't imagine what would happen though if I doubled my lighting again.
What exactly are you adding when you say 3.5 ml of nitrate and 2 ml of phosphate? Do you know how many ppm's you are adding?
12-29-2007, 12:24 AM
So I ajusted my ferts to this after VaughnH post nitrate 7 ml=7.56 ppm, phosphate 3 ml=1.59ppm, potassium 1\8 tsp barr's gh booster 1\4 tsp (after water change), plantex 2 ml, iron 2 ml=0.2 ppm all is being dosed daily except gh booster. Ferts are dry ferts from Greg Watson's site. Nitrate is Potassium nitrate, mono potassium phosphate, potassium sulfate(only dosed dry) all my ferts I mix in water of 250 ml and x fert. I used the calc from Chuck Glad's site for my calculations. So for every ml I add I get N=1.08 ppm, K= 0.53 ppm, iron=0.1 ppm per 10 gals of water. If I'm wrong here please correct me, cause I use the same bottle on my 29 gal also. Ferts for 29 gal are as follows N 20 ml, P 9 ml, K 1\4 tsp, 3\4 gh booster, plantex 6ml, iron 6ml. The 29 gal has 4.7 wpg of cf lighting, co2, and has very little algea. Wpg may be off might be 4.2 wpg don't remember what watt the other 2 bulbs are 1 is a 65 w and other 2 are smaller I think are 36 w. Thanks for the link.
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